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Post by tarzan on Jan 7, 2015 9:28:23 GMT 10
offdshoulder, I agree with what you have written. I have never liked the "Marque" idea, Ok it worked with D.Yorke in the beginning but the SYD FC just keep relying on bringing big name players in and hoping it makes a difference. Yes ADP may have been a crowd puller, but what about after ADP. Now what, the players are getting older, injuries etc. Is there a plan or program for the future ? As far as Carle goes, he never played to his full potential although some of the coaches didn't utilize him well at all. Adelaide is full of foreign players, but do we have the enough good players here ? Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... Ibini....fast but no idea what to do when he gets the ball other than run straight ahead Smeltz...over the hill Janko .....for a 9 he sure has trouble scoring goals
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Post by offdshoulder on Jan 7, 2015 9:30:48 GMT 10
I know it was frustrating to watch ADP walk around the park and the private dressing room situation may have been awkward for many but ADP achieved if not exceeded all expectations. SFC crowds were fantastic and much improved. Media exposure and interest generated in him and by default the A-League were remarkable also. The buzz into other franchises similarly - Shinji Ono, Emile Heskey etc etc. On the field 48 games 24 goals. The finishing skills and diversity in his shooting, his dribbling skills and passing was an example for all and sundry. Comparatively, Nicky Carle the other 'No.10' has scored a little over 40 goals in his entire career.
SFC and it's administration has been impulsive, reactive and poorly planned from day dot. Do they have the capacity to take something from the ADP experience? If not they are not suited to administering a football club. Do they plan for the future?Who knows. I'm not entirely convinced they really ever wanted Youth Teams either. It's much easier to buy than develop. Especially when the Premier League Clubs are not compensated for the talent 'they produce' and the market is limited to 10 franchises.
Do we have the talented coaches? Do we have the talented players? Do we have a knowledgable football culture?
The game domestically faces numerous challenges...developing coaches is a huge task and not valued domestically. The paucity of opportunities available ensures a natural tendency to the status quo. i.e. experienced coaches with extensive CVs and experience tend to get the jobs and new talent tends to be overlooked because, ....they don't have experience. Furthermore ex-palyers tend to be given jobs without having the necessary skill set suited to their role and the younger players suffer as a consequence. There may be a little 'Star dust' with senior players but the confusion whilst working their way through the transition from player to coach confuses the learning experience for the younger players.Young players need better coaches than senior players do.
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Post by offdshoulder on Jan 7, 2015 9:44:57 GMT 10
I'm starting to feel sorry for the WSW. Poppa may be in trouble here. Difficult situation for all I believe. Asian Champs too last in the A-League. It seems all the success they've had in the last 3 years has just abandoned them. WSW epitomise administration in this country. A panic solution for a lunatic Gold Coast Exodus. A difficult pill to swallow for the other Sydney Team too- cosy market places ensure you are going to have at least 'x' number of faithful football diehards irrespective of the dross you deliver. Surprise, surprise the Western Suburbs fans who never travelled anywhere even during the NSL days go out and support them in droves in there heartland!! I must confess I was really happy for WSW and their success ( but I am not a big fan of their cautious approach). I couldn't believe they let three of the most creative in the team go in one off season. Ono, Hershey and Moye - I don't understand how you can do that!! Football is a fickle and imprecise Science - when it works you don't change things if you can avoid it.
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Post by martintyler on Jan 7, 2015 10:08:14 GMT 10
offdshoulder, As far as Carle goes, he never played to his full potential although some of the coaches didn't utilize him well at all. Adelaide is full of foreign players, but do we have the enough good players here ? Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... I don't recall Carle playing in the EPL. He was a fringe Championship player at best.
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Post by martintyler on Jan 7, 2015 10:10:35 GMT 10
I'm starting to feel sorry for the WSW. Poppa may be in trouble here. Difficult situation for all I believe. Asian Champs too last in the A-League. It seems all the success they've had in the last 3 years has just abandoned them. WSW epitomise administration in this country. A panic solution for a lunatic Gold Coast Exodus. A difficult pill to swallow for the other Sydney Team too- cosy market places ensure you are going to have at least 'x' number of faithful football diehards irrespective of the dross you deliver. Surprise, surprise the Western Suburbs fans who never travelled anywhere even during the NSL days go out and support them in droves in there heartland!! I must confess I was really happy for WSW and their success ( but I am not a big fan of their cautious approach). I couldn't believe they let three of the most creative in the team go in one off season. Ono, Hershey and Moye - I don't understand how you can do that!! Football is a fickle and imprecise Science - when it works you don't change things if you can avoid it. I think you'll find that the salary cap was a significant factor in last season's departures. I don't like it but it is a Franchised league and on the plus side there's no relegation !!
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Post by fiik on Jan 7, 2015 10:23:23 GMT 10
Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... I don't recall Carle playing in the EPL. He was a fringe Championship player at best. MT, at your age I am suprised you recall anything at all!
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Post by martintyler on Jan 7, 2015 10:24:26 GMT 10
I don't recall Carle playing in the EPL. He was a fringe Championship player at best. MT, at your age I am suprised you recall anything at all! Who are you?.....
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Post by fiik on Jan 7, 2015 10:39:58 GMT 10
lol
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Post by tarzan on Jan 7, 2015 10:41:30 GMT 10
Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... I don't recall Carle playing in the EPL. He was a fringe Championship player at best. Think you're right. Was it Crystal Palace pre EPL?
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Post by offdshoulder on Jan 7, 2015 10:42:01 GMT 10
offdshoulder, I agree with what you have written. I have never liked the "Marque" idea, Ok it worked with D.Yorke in the beginning but the SYD FC just keep relying on bringing big name players in and hoping it makes a difference. Yes ADP may have been a crowd puller, but what about after ADP. Now what, the players are getting older, injuries etc. Is there a plan or program for the future ? As far as Carle goes, he never played to his full potential although some of the coaches didn't utilize him well at all. Adelaide is full of foreign players, but do we have the enough good players here ? Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... Ibini....fast but no idea what to do when he gets the ball other than run straight ahead Smeltz...over the hill Janko .....for a 9 he sure has trouble scoring goals Nicky has attracted a lot of admiration and has numerous fans. I don't dislike him ..I just don't rate him as highly as some of his fans. For me ..the game slows down considerably when he has the ball, he likes to show his skill set, i don't believe his shooting is up to the standard of a No. 10, his non dominant foot is severely below par and of no threat to the opposition, his short passing game is good / long passing game - not to the standard of a No. 10. (good strikers of the ball tend to have good long passing and good crossing skills also - he doesn't have this), Nicky has always suffered with the physical pace of the game and for me his technical strengths do not overcome his physical deficiencies. South Americans have always loved the skill aspects - Coever did too. But Tarzan I think the isolation/wholistic concept has it's flaws and Australia needs to be very careful about this. Smeltz and Janko I think are good players - I have seen them play at the ground several times of late. The speed with which they offer a reference point is too slow for me, combination play is not as developed as it should and as a consequence Sydney dominate possession but have difficulty threatening. Ibini has been in the system for several years now. He's naturally very athletic and unfortunately I don't see any expansion of his repertoire over the last years. I also think he takes too long with his decision making. If you combine indecision with a limited skill set / option capacity you get a player that is predictable. Predictability reduces effectiveness. I think with the right coaching he'd make a hell of a fullback
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Post by martintyler on Jan 7, 2015 10:48:31 GMT 10
I don't recall Carle playing in the EPL. He was a fringe Championship player at best. Think you're right. Was it Crystal Palace pre EPL? Palace have been one of those 'yo yo' teams. Definitely Championship while he was on the books.
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Post by tarzan on Jan 7, 2015 10:59:37 GMT 10
Nicky Carle has always looked like a Coerver kid to me .....knows all the ball tricks but not when to utilise them....and can't play football. Is he the model example of isolated v holistic approach to training? Yeah I know he did play in the EPL but.... Ibini....fast but no idea what to do when he gets the ball other than run straight ahead Smeltz...over the hill Janko .....for a 9 he sure has trouble scoring goals Nicky has attracted a lot of admiration and has numerous fans. I don't dislike him ..I just don't rate him as highly as some of his fans. For me ..the game slows down considerably when he has the ball, he likes to show his skill set, i don't believe his shooting is up to the standard of a No. 10, his non dominant foot is severely below par and of no threat to the opposition, his short passing game is good / long passing game - not to the standard of a No. 10. (good strikers of the ball tend to have good long passing and good crossing skills also - he doesn't have this), Nicky has always suffered with the physical pace of the game and for me his technical strengths do not overcome his physical deficiencies. South Americans have always loved the skill aspects - Coever did too. But Tarzan I think the isolation/wholistic concept has it's flaws and Australia needs to be very careful about this. Smeltz and Janko I think are good players - I have seen them play at the ground several times of late. The speed with which they offer a reference point is too slow for me, combination play is not as developed as it should and as a consequence Sydney dominate possession but have difficulty threatening. Ibini has been in the system for several years now. He's naturally very athletic and unfortunately I don't see any expansion of his repertoire over the last years. I also think he takes too long with his decision making. If you combine indecision with a limited skill set / option capacity you get a player that is predictable. Predictability reduces effectiveness. I think with the right coaching he'd make a hell of a fullback Agree. Listening to the commentators re Ibini is a worry......they think he is fantastic simply because he's fast. Is that the extent of local knowledge of football? Give me the Adelaide players (ie the internationals) any day as a template to follow for developing Australian footballers. Forget the Ibini, Rukavytsa ( how one footed is this guy....spent all game last night playing with the outside of the right foot?).....Is Adelaides Mabil another one? Examples of players that have not been developed but rather have tons of natural ability?? re Isolated/holistic I have no doubt it's not one or the other....the right balance is important. In fact from what I see we could do with a bit more isolated.
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Post by kookaburra on Jan 7, 2015 15:35:42 GMT 10
Is there a Aussie born striker that can score ?
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Post by kookaburra on Jan 7, 2015 15:36:55 GMT 10
tarzan,
You are spot on about Ibini and Janko.
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Post by enmorecat on Jan 7, 2015 15:56:47 GMT 10
I don't particularly like Sydney FC (or anyone apart from Perth Glory for that matter), but I think Janko's record up to 2012 is relatively good. Lots of goals in Austria, did well in Holland and does a little better than 1 in 3 internationally, so he isn't a dud and if an Australian had that record we would be talking it up big time. I just think that Sydney have had some injury issues which have proven bigger than what most imagined they would be and some disjointedness in Arnold's approach, possibly because of that. I think he is much more in the spotlight here and clearly the way he is starring to whinge suggests he is feeling the pressure. It is a pretty open A League this year and it might be that they get on a run and put this behind them.
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